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I guarantee if you ran a disc same speed and depth, you will see a much smoother job on 18" blades versus 24". Like a 14" plow bottom versus an 18".
Your guarantee is an opinion but without facts. You're not taking into consideration many variables such as difference in design of implements by different manufacturers,angle of disk blades & penetration depth of disks..Do you mean smoothness as in more or less clods or peaks & valley's which is what OP started this thread about??? I never pulled a 18'' moldboard but I saw no difference in the levelness of soil between a 14'' & 16'' moldboard IF PLOW WAS ADJUSTED CORRECTLY which some people don't know how to do.
 
Your guarantee is an opinion but without facts. You're not taking into consideration many variables such as difference in design of implements by different manufacturers,angle of disk blades & penetration depth of disks..Do you mean smoothness as in more or less clods or peaks & valley's which is what OP started this thread about??? I never pulled a 18'' moldboard but I saw no difference in the levelness of soil between a 14'' & 16'' moldboard IF PLOW WAS ADJUSTED CORRECTLY which some people don't know how to do.
Screw it. You're right, I'm wrong. This site isn't worth getting into a pissing match, so I'm done.
 
stack em up

There's no need to get upset just because we disagree. I started plowing over 60 yrs ago and I've plowed a several 1000 acres. Plus I sold & delivered new & used plows for several yrs. Have a nice day,

Jim
 
Not sure how to explain on here its more of a draw it on the hood of the tractor explanation.
Preferably a dusty hood I would expect. :D

Larry
 
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Hayden-I have the same issue with my JD 12' #110 disk. I run a 16' double 6 x 6 drag behind it. 6x 6s are held about 2' apart with allthread. All I look for from my disk is loosening and chopping clods. I then use my brillion roller harrow (has two rows of spring tooth shanks). I run the shanks deep the first pass, then up several slots on following passes. The last pass they barely touch the ground. Leaves a nice finish. Still think that an old spring tooth harrow run with diagonal cross passes is hard to beat if you have a field that is big enough to make it efficient.
 
Discussion starter · #48 ·
Well I tried a couple passes with the cultimulcher running the tines down without discing and it actually worked a lot better than I imagined it would.....left the ground a lot smoother than the disc. The trouble is this ground was already pretty unlevel from the past couple years of running this disc and the cultimulcher just couldn't move enough dirt around to fix that. If the ground hadn't been previously worked the past couple years with a disc that was ridging the cultimulcher probably would have worked pretty good.

I decided to call my fertilizer dealer to see if he had any old tillage equipment from years gone by that I could use. All he had left was an old IH disc.....I decided to get the disc and see if it did any better than mine. I hooked the railroad iron behind it as a drag and was fairly pleased with how it did.....a lot better and more level job than my Taylor Way. Didnt get much done before it started raining this evening......wasn't supposed to start until midnight.
 
20" discs at 9" spacing on the front gangs and 7 1/2" spacing on the rear gangs.
Ok reason I asked is that usually the wider the spacing the rougher they leave the ground and the more uneven it is... (plowing disk at say 11 inch blade spacing versus a "finishing disk" at 7.5 blade spacing all around).

Gang angles can have a big effect too-- the steeper the gang angle, the more they throw the dirt sideways, and the more critical leveling becomes to prevent ridging or furrowing...

Later! OL J R :)
 
My cultimulcher has c tines. I'm not trying to finish the ground with the disc.....just using it to work down the chisel plowed ground before running the cultimulcher. It just seems like I'm going backwards though in getting the ground smooth since the disc is leaving the ground so unlevel. It sounds like I have tried to make the proper adjustments on the disc without much luck so as I suspected it sounds like my disc is just a pos.

With only having this disc and a cultimulcher to work with at this point what would be your method of trying to get the ground as smooth and level as possible for planting?
Go get you a chain harrow that you can hitch behind the disk with some chains... or spike tooth harrow gangs, if you can get them.

Later! OL J R :)
 
Do you have any facts to prove your statement? If one utilized hyd cylinder stops so each disk harrow penetrated the soil at the same depth & were pulled at the same ground speed I doubt one could tell much difference in the levelness of soil because of disk diameter.
Worn blades= less concavity (not as deep a "dish'' to the blade anymore, thus less throwing of dirt to the side by the blade. Plus, less cutting depth of course, though as you said, you can adjust that with depth stops on larger blades.

Sorta like the difference between cone blades that throw dirt a LOT and spherical blades which throw dirt less...

Later! OL J R :)
 
(Snip)

I never pulled a 18'' moldboard but I saw no difference in the levelness of soil between a 14'' & 16'' moldboard IF PLOW WAS ADJUSTED CORRECTLY which some people don't know how to do.
This is true... 90% or more of EVERYTHING is in the ADJUSTMENTS...

The best place to start-- THE OPERATOR'S MANUAL!!!!

Once you've done it awhile, experience is the best guide... but, lacking that, or if all else fails-- READ THE FLIPPIN' BOOK!!!!

Later! OL J R :)
 
Well I tried a couple passes with the cultimulcher running the tines down without discing and it actually worked a lot better than I imagined it would.....left the ground a lot smoother than the disc. The trouble is this ground was already pretty unlevel from the past couple years of running this disc and the cultimulcher just couldn't move enough dirt around to fix that. If the ground hadn't been previously worked the past couple years with a disc that was ridging the cultimulcher probably would have worked pretty good.

I decided to call my fertilizer dealer to see if he had any old tillage equipment from years gone by that I could use. All he had left was an old IH disc.....I decided to get the disc and see if it did any better than mine. I hooked the railroad iron behind it as a drag and was fairly pleased with how it did.....a lot better and more level job than my Taylor Way. Didnt get much done before it started raining this evening......wasn't supposed to start until midnight.
Well, there IS such a thing as "plowing disks" and "finishing disks"... Though of course it's kinda subjective and a LOT of things can be overcome by how it's adjusted and operated, and of course the conditions and soils and stuff where it's being run.

"Plowing disks" are usually heavier and designed to run deeper, to break hard soil loose, cut sod or crop residue, and move the ground and break it up. Of course, in doing this, they usually make it pretty rough and, depending on design, conditions, adjustments, and operation, can leave the field in very rough condition with some pretty bad ridging or furrowing or both. "Plowing disks" usually have bigger diameter blades that can "get down in the soil deeper" and steeper gang angles, and blade spacings of 11 inches down to 9 inches. They're also usually heavier to help them penetrate the ground better.

"Finishing disks" are usually a little lighter so they stay on top of looser soil easier with less compaction and can run at a more consistent depth. The blade gang angles are usually lower to minimize throwing of soil to the sides, and blades are usually a little smaller (maybe 16-18 inch blades versus say 22-24's, though it depends on when it was manufactured, as larger blades are pretty much "standard" now). In the old days, they had "low concavity" and "high concavity" blades-- low concavity (flatter blade) was more for finishing work (throw less soil due to less "curve" to the blade) and high concavity blades were more for "plowing" with the disk (throw/flip the dirt more because the blade was "deeper" (more curved) for a given size, thus causing the soil to curl and "roll" further aside as it came off the blade, throwing it further). Of course there was also (and still is to some extent) scalloped (notched) blades for chopping up residue and helping to penetrate sod or hard ground, and smooth edge blades for general work.

Now, there's SOME cross-over in disk design, and some compromises and tradeoffs made that sort of balance out the disk's design to make it more a "jack of all trades"... IIRC Taylor Way disks have pretty heavy frames to help them penetrate and give them strength for "plowing" work... with steeper gang angles and deeper working depths, they'll move a lot of soil. With larger blades, you'll need depth stops to keep it from going to deep, especially in lighter, looser soils without a lot of residue and stuff. The 9 inch blade spacing on the front gang is a "happy medium" between the mainly "plowing disk" 11 inch blade spacing and the true "finishing disk" 7.5 in blade spacing all around.

If it were me, I'd look at the job it's doing and try to do a little detective work and make some adjustments to make things work the best I could. If you're trying to make one pass over the field and be done, that's probably not going to work-- especially if you're sinking the disk in to cut as deep as you can... the deeper you cut, the more it's going to furrow or ridge. If you need the ground worked deep, make one pass the same direction you'll eventually be cutting, raking, and baling your hay (so that you're not jumping any residual unevenness ridges or furrows) and disk it "deep as it'll go", then do a follow up pass ON THE BIAS (at an angle to the first cut, about 30 degree angle or so) with the disk SHALLOWED UP so that levels and smooths everything out. You might not be cutting but 2-3 inches deep or so...

Look at the blade gang angle-- the steepest angle possible will move the dirt the most and do the best job breaking up the ground, BUT, moving the dirt the most to either side WILL contribute to furrowing/ridging, ESPECIALLY when working deeply. If you need max angle for breaking up the ground, fine, but before making your second pass, reduce the blade gang angle to MINIMUM (or near minimum, as required for a good job) so that you're not throwing the soil SO far on subsequent passes so it laps over itself and forms a ridge, or leaving as deep/wide of a furrow on gang ends... Speed ALSO plays a role in how far the dirt is thrown-- the faster the disk is run, the farther the soil will be thrown as it leaves the blade-- the curve of the blade (or taper in the case of conical blades) imparts a sideways curving path (in combination with the gang angle) to the soil as it leaves the blade... the more speed, the "harder the throw" of the soil as it comes off the rolling blade. If the blade is turning slower, the less energy it's putting into the soil that it's "throwing" off the blade, and thus the less far it will be moved before it lands and stops moving.

Of course the leveling screw/handle is the first thing to check-- a disk running with too much down pressure on the rear gang and too much up pressure on the front gang is going to want to make some wicked ridges-- the front gang won't be cutting in as far or moving as much volume of soil AWAY from the center as the rear blades, with more weight transferred through the leveling spring onto the rear blades, will be moving TOWARD the center, thus causing ridging in the center, and potentially deep furrowing at the outer ends of the rear gangs (if not equipped with the little "furrow filler" blades on the outer ends of the gangs (modern disks). It can also cause a "double humped" ridge just inside the outer ends of the rear gangs as they cut too much soil from the outer end blades and throw it onto the disked swath, then on the next pass, the outer rear disk blade will follow along very close (or overlapping) this "trench" left by the rear outermost blade cutting the opposite direction, creating a "double hump" ridge looking like a cross-section letter "M"...

Likewise, a disk set with too much weight transferred onto the front gangs will throw too much soil away from the center of the disk because the front gangs will cut too deep compared to the rear gangs, which won't be moving enough soil back to fill in the large furrow left by the center end blades of the front gangs, and the disk will ridge much worse where the soil thrown by the outer end front blades is overlapped by dirt from the outer end front blade on the next pass-- the rear blades won't be able to bring that soil back out and level it out. If you're seeing a deep "V" furrow in the center of your disk behind the rear gangs, and a pronounced upside down "U" shaped ridge on either side of the front gangs (especially on subsquent passes where the edges overlap) your front gangs are running too deep-- raise the tongue with the leveling screw to transfer more weight to the rear gangs and "level it out". If you're seeing a pronounced center "upside down "U" shaped" ridge in the center of the disk, possibly with a noticeable double-arches type "M" looking ridge/furrow/ridge where the back outside end blades are abutting from one pass to the next, you have too much pressure on your rear gangs-- turn the leveling screw to lower the tongue and put more pressure on the front gangs and level it out.

There IS NO "set it and forget it" when it comes to leveling a disk-- that's why they have a LEVELING SCREW... my stupid old Ford disk didn't have a leveling screw-- you had to take out two bolts and move a "stop" up and down in a pocket, with both of them drilled with a mess of overlapping holes-- move it a bit and find a couple holes that line up, shove the bolts back in, and tighten it down... total PITA when it came to doing leveling "finish work" on flat ground-- but we ran mostly on beds disking out stalks in the fall and incorporating Trifluralin on cotton ground in the spring, and disking beds is a little different animal anyway compared to flatland disking... BASICALLY, ever time you take the disk to the field YOU SHOULD LEVEL IT... make a couple passes, judge the job it's doing, and then adjust appropriately, and REPEAT... tweak it til it's doing the job you want...

Your last pass should be MUCH shallower than earlier passes-- sometimes, depending on the hardness of your soil or sod, and how deep and well you want it "worked up" you might have to disk multiple times-- each time you disk, the disk will want to cut a little deeper than the previous pass, especially in harder ground or sod... BUT, the deeper the disk goes, the MORE it will compound the ridging/furrowing problem-- minimize it by working at an ANGLE (on the bias) to the first pass-- generally 30 degrees to either the left or right... this will keep the ridges and furrows from getting worse with each subsequent pass. Once you've got it worked deep enough, SHALLOW UP on "finishing" passes to crumble and level the soil surface, and, if at all possible, pull a heavy drag (RR iron, lite pole, even channel iron will work, tires, etc) or a chain-link harrow (or drag harrow gangs) to further level the soil behind the disk. Set gang angles to minimum, disk only as deep as needed to flatten out the ridges and fill the furrows, NOT maximum depth... use cylinder stops or set the 3 point control as required to hold the disk at a shallow depth. Slow down if the soil is still being thrown too far...

That's just the general gist of it... Best of luck and hope this helps!

Later! OL J R :)
 
The best tillage tool I've seen yet is a Great Plains turbo max. Single pass that thing left a perfect seedbed, they make them small as 8' and although pricey it eliminates 3-5 passes with finishing disc cultivator and a couple harrow passes. A friend of mine has been pulling a 35' and I'll be buying one before long but not quite that big.

http://www.greatplainsag.com/en/products/418/turbo-max®
 
The best tillage tool I've seen yet is a Great Plains turbo max. Single pass that thing left a perfect seedbed, they make them small as 8' and although pricey it eliminates 3-5 passes with finishing disc cultivator and a couple harrow passes. A friend of mine has been pulling a 35' and I'll be buying one before long but not quite that big.

http://www.greatplainsag.com/en/products/418/turbo-max®
do you know if it can break up sod fairly well? I've heard great things about A similar thing from Lemken
 
Discussion starter · #59 ·
The best tillage tool I've seen yet is a Great Plains turbo max. Single pass that thing left a perfect seedbed, they make them small as 8' and although pricey it eliminates 3-5 passes with finishing disc cultivator and a couple harrow passes. A friend of mine has been pulling a 35' and I'll be buying one before long but not quite that big.
http://www.greatplainsag.com/en/products/418/turbo-max®
Yep I like the looks of the Turbo Max but I was thinking they were more of a minimum tillage implement though and not designed for working up plowed ground. Do you know if it would work well in ground that has been chisel plowed and needs leveled out?
 
Yep I like the looks of the Turbo Max but I was thinking they were more of a minimum tillage implement though and not designed for working up plowed ground. Do you know if it would work well in ground that has been chisel plowed and needs leveled out?
With the gangs straight i would think it would do an exelent job as well but I haven't personally seen that. I don't see any need in pulling a chisel if you have the turbo max to pull across the ground. They want 25k for a 10' model but if I can eliminate 3-5 passes across the ground for a normal planting what is that worth $$ wise. My teff ground I finally got worked up and ready to plant but it took me 7 trips across the field to get it in near perfect shape and if I can find a cultimulcher I'll add one more to that. With my current equipment I chiseled, disced 3 times pulled the finishing cultivator then harrowed twice.
 
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