Hay & Forage Forum banner
1 - 7 of 7 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi all,
I replaced the right side knotter due to its broken frame and I want to make sure it doesn't happen again so I'm trying to get knotter stack endplay adjusted right on.
I put everything together back as it was but my knotters have always been able to move up/down freely when springs/pins are removed. Maybe that was my problem. my pinion gear faces have some wear but are in fair shape. Even though knotter frames move freely up/down, there is no real side to side play.
Well the 3 end shims for the bolt are on the very end not being used. The shaft behind the big washer is recessed an 1/8", so tightening the 3/8 bolt applies pressure to the stack, but not enough to prevent both knotters from very freely moving. I'm afraid to tighten that 3/8 bolt any more. Do I need to add washers to the stack on the "washers (as required)" point on the sevicing the knotter stack diagram?
I've baled about 3000 small squares per year for 4 years with the knotters "loose" like this but don't want to give myself problems in the future.
Also, after I get end play squared away I'll check needle clearances and go through knotter settings/adjustments. Anything specific to look for when putting on one new (used) knotter?
Thanks all!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,223 Posts
Hi all,
I replaced the right side knotter due to its broken frame and I want to make sure it doesn't happen again so I'm trying to get knotter stack endplay adjusted right on.
I put everything together back as it was but my knotters have always been able to move up/down freely when springs/pins are removed. Maybe that was my problem. my pinion gear faces have some wear but are in fair shape. Even though knotter frames move freely up/down, there is no real side to side play.
Well the 3 end shims for the bolt are on the very end not being used. The shaft behind the big washer is recessed an 1/8", so tightening the 3/8 bolt applies pressure to the stack, but not enough to prevent both knotters from very freely moving. I'm afraid to tighten that 3/8 bolt any more. Do I need to add washers to the stack on the "washers (as required)" point on the sevicing the knotter stack diagram?
I've baled about 3000 small squares per year for 4 years with the knotters "loose" like this but don't want to give myself problems in the future.
Also, after I get end play squared away I'll check needle clearances and go through knotter settings/adjustments. Anything specific to look for when putting on one new (used) knotter?
Thanks all!
Deleted as not sure if my answer was right.
 

·
Senior Member
Joined
·
2,744 Posts
First, replace all four pinion gears. To shim the stack. Loosen the clamp bolt on the arm on the right side of the stack. There should be shims under the large washer on the end. Remove shims until the knotters frames will still rotate down on their own when the knotter frames are raised and then released. Don,t let the frames drop or the knife arms will wedge on the twine fingers. If you remove all the shims and you still have endplay, then you will need to add a shim washer between the right knotter support and the right large knotter cam gear.

I think my pinned thread at the top of the machinery forum contains photos and instructions on the shimming process. Scroll down the first post to the square baler section.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
First, replace all four pinion gears. To shim the stack. Loosen the clamp bolt on the arm on the right side of the stack. There should be shims under the large washer on the end. Remove shims until the knotters frames will still rotate down on their own when the knotter frames are raised and then released. Don,t let the frames drop or the knife arms will wedge on the twine fingers. If you remove all the shims and you still have endplay, then you will need to add a shim washer between the right knotter support and the right large knotter cam gear.

I think my pinned thread at the top of the machinery forum contains photos and instructions on the shimming process. Scroll down the first post to the square baler section.
Thanks Mike, i was hoping you would reply. I've been using your posts and some of your threads and documents as reference. How imperative is it that the pinion gears are new? I mean, there is wear on them but I don't feel as though they are worn out.

The were no shims under the big washer, they were all on top of it. Looks like I'll have to go back in to it to add a washer between the knotter support and large cam gear. If I do this, it's going to make the knotter stack stick out 3/16 past the shaft. Seems a little excessive.
 

·
Senior Member
Joined
·
2,744 Posts
Not excessive at all. Originally there were 2 - 5/16 flat washers and 4 - 5 of the thins shims under the heavy washer. I would put shims under the large washer so the small bolt can be tighten completely. You can pull the shaft until the shaft is flush with the arm. At that point you will need to add the larger shim washer between the support a n cam gear To tighten farther.

Number one reason for knotter frame failures is worn pinion gear and excess endplay. If you use the original pinions, be sure to take a 9/16 wrench and turn the twine disc drive shaft so you get the flat side of the twine disc pinion against the cam gear, not the worn corner. After shimming, if the twine disc pinion was worn, you will see a gap between the pinion corner and cam gear. There is nothing you can do with the billhook pinion except to see how much rotational movement you have. Ideally there will be little movement. When shimming it is the twine disc pinion which contacts the cam gear first. That is why I recommend replacing all the pinions. Remember, it is not only the pinion gears that are worn, but the cam gears wear also. Given enough slop and force from the knotting process and you end up with the billhook pinion jumping time.

I know the pinions are not cheap, but frames and knife arms are not cheap either. Take a photo of each pinion from the top and post the photo. I think I may have photos in my pinned post on knotters showing worn pinion gears.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Yep, worn pinion gears are page 2 in the file on knotter repair part 1. I'll look at mine again but I don't remember them worn like that. There wasn't a corner/edge worn, it was more like the face had some uneven wear up and down it.
Thanks!!
 
1 - 7 of 7 Posts
Top