14 replies to this topic

[Hollybelle33]

Buying 70 acres that’s presently cut for hay. The couple want to continue, but won’t tell me their current arrangement. They want me to come up with something and present it to them.

Totally a novice. I bought the land to keep 135 houses buying built on it. Any suggestions plus be much appreciated!!

[r82230]

Will present owner give you any hints?

 

More info might be helpful:

 

What kind of hay?  Guessing I would lean towards OG and/or Timothy. 

 

Other variables:  real hilly, odd shaped fields, bunch of small fields, one big mostly flat field, come to mind.

 

Present renter with no input, but I'd still ask them a few questions:

 

Do they want to continue haying this property?  My thinking here is they could be looking for a way to get out of doing this property, they have been possibly getting it for nothing and/or mining the nutrients.   So are 'looking' for a reason (easy way out ) to stop farming it. 

 

If so, do they want to do the soil testing/lime/fertilizing or for you to include in your side of the calculation?

 

If you have a need/want of any hay, then ask about doing shares.  Therefore sharing the risk/reward side of the equation. 

 

Do they want a longer term lease (there are costs associated with producing hay, that can be utilized over more than one year)?   Example liming or establishing alfalfa or even OG or Timothy. 

 

This is all based upon the assumption (and I know how an assumption can be extremely wrong  ) that you live in the area/close by at least.

 

Oh, BTW welcome to HT.

 

Larry

[Trillium Farm]

Buying 70 acres that’s presently cut for hay. The couple want to continue, but won’t tell me their current arrangement. They want me to come up with something and present it to them.

Totally a novice. I bought the land to keep 135 houses buying built on it. Any suggestions plus be much appreciated!!

Are you buying the land or the crop? I'd infer, due to the "arrangement" that you're not buying the land, am I right?

[Hollybelle33]

Buying the land.

 

I have no idea what type of anything is on it, just know that they have farmed it for hay and want to continue the arrangement. Unfortunately, the owner passed away and there is a huge family squabble over the money, so I don't really have anyone to ask.

 

I know nothing about hay, but I know that it will need to be kept up and cut. We do not have any use for the hay and especially don't know anything about cutting it correctly.

 

I have heard just let them do it and keep the hay, let them do it and charge them a lease, etc. 

[chevytaHOE5674]

Depends on location. Around "here" in the northern tundra you would let them cut the hay just for keeping the field from growing up in brush and for the ag tax exemption if necessary. Rarely does money change hands for hay stumpage.

[endrow]

Tell those intrested to pay you $225 per acre.At that point they will be able to talk about what they paid in the past...

[Hollybelle33]

It is in Tennessee. Still so curious why they won't discuss their arrangement, but want to keep doing it. Maybe I should look at other sources, too?

[r82230]

It is in Tennessee. Still so curious why they won't discuss their arrangement, but want to keep doing it. Maybe I should look at other sources, too?

 

"Family squabble over money" could be a clue.  Could've been paying nothing (as Chevy mentions) while mining the soil of nutrients or paying almost zero, but paying for all soil amendments (lime / fertilizer) or could have been paying fair market value, while maintaining soil nutrients.   In any case, present renter might not want to be in the middle of a family squabble, that might be looking for more $$$. 

 

You could charge:

• Nothing, just to keep obnoxious weeds from growing
• Nothing, plus soil amendments (at least it wouldn't become over grown with possible negative vegetation).
• $5-10 an acre, plus soil amendments (a little something towards your property taxes/insurance).
• FMV of local land rent, maybe a trip to the local extension office could be of value, (No disrespect intended to some very knowledgeable folks here on HT). 

I'd say choose the second bullet point at the minimum, BUT I don't know YOUR area.  Chevy and myself are both located in the same state, and you can see the differences in OUR respected areas.

 

Larry

[somedevildawg]

Welcome to Haytalk hollybelle33,

I’ve done the same thing before so I certainly understand your position. Fella wanted to buy the land across the road from me to build 220 houses on 90 ac. Didn’t work out so well for him, or me
But, I would take advice/tip number 4 (although he neglected to use any numbering system) above in Larry’s always insightful post. A local extension agent knows your area, he knows your farmers and he can give you an idea of exactly what you have. It may be worth nothing more than advice/tip number 1 (again, no numbering system so proceed at risk ) or it may be worth $30-60 an acre for decent ground....your locale and market will dictate that and it’s something that most wont be able to answer here. However, if you get to needing any equipment and advice on how to grow something on said property....you have hit the jackpot here, we love helping folks spend money!
Good luck!

[dvcochran]

It is in Tennessee. Still so curious why they won't discuss their arrangement, but want to keep doing it. Maybe I should look at other sources, too?

I farm just west of Nashville. If you are close and need someone to walk over or talk about the situation I am glad to help. Middle TN is getting raped for housing development so I am always happy to help someone keep their farmland going. Feel free to PM me. 

[Beav]

If you are buying to stop development, I am assuming money is not a problem. If you can get your property taxes reduced by having the ground farmed is helpful. We do shares two ways 50/50 input expenses and crop is split or 75/25 renter pays all expenses. In either case we buy your share of the hay out of the field and pay you after the last cutting done. we have been doing this for over 20 years work well in this area

[KRT]

I farm just west of Nashville. If you are close and need someone to walk over or talk about the situation I am glad to help. Middle TN is getting raped for housing development so I am always happy to help someone keep their farmland going. Feel free to PM me.

I’m just north of Nashville, if he’s anywhere close to where we are he’s gonna need the $225 per acre and then some that Endrow mentioned to put a dent in that payment, like you said, it’s a bad situation around here

[ttazzman]

personally i would do a lease..not sure the value but you could be below market if needed......but i would want issues like liability insurance, soil amendments, specific usage by both of you, property care, etc all spelled out in the lease, a knowledgeable atty would be a plus

 

someone mentioned talking to the local "extension" people about values i think that would be wise

 

personally i would want a minimum of annual property taxes and insurance paid by any lessor ...but that is just me

 

everything changes with local markets of course.

 

obviously if they/you are not intrested in a formal lease then some form of hay agreement could be reached .....no matter what i think i would do formal soil fertility testing upon purchase to establish a base line for future possible negotiations

[Cantrellc123]

I was talking about this at our Co op and I was told average rent for hay ground near me in southern middle Tennessee is $20.00 per acre. I have no idea how it is elsewhere 

[EPTexan]

I was talking about this at our Co op and I was told average rent for hay ground near me in southern middle Tennessee is $20.00 per acre. I have no idea how it is elsewhere 

Just for clarification, is it $20/acre per month or year?