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Lump jaw bull


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#1 seventyfourci

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Posted 29 May 2020 - 11:03 AM

I have a bull with a large lump under his jaw, because of him having a set of horns that are wider than I can reach across and him being somewhat unfriendly you do not see him very often. He has been on wheat pasture and should be slick and shiny. When I saw him he is poor and it looks like his tongue is sticking out too far and he is slobbering. I have not had any of these lump jaw cattle since I was a kid and it was always debris that caused an infection under their tongue. I mentioned this to a friend of mine in the same business he said it may be parasites to put ivermectin on him and it would take care of it. I remember having to lance the lumps and work the bs out of it which is a problem with this bull unless I use a pneumatic gun and tranquilize him. Is it a possibility that it is a parasite and if so will ivermectin take care of it or do I go ahead and knock him down and lance it?



#2 BWfarms

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Posted 29 May 2020 - 12:46 PM

To answer your question; Yes it can be parasites that give a 'lump jaw' but I don't think it's very common like sheep. Worms will definitely cause an animal to look rough. Never hurts to give a strong dose to rule out parasites, especially if you haven't recently.

Hard to say the cause without looking at the bull but what do you mean by poor shape? Thin or fat and shaggy? Soft swelling likely parasites. Hard swelling sounds bacterial. The tongue out could be a number of things; the swelling is so bad, has a foreign object stuck, or panting to keep cool because in bad condition. Either way you are going to need to restrain him to check for sure.
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#3 seventyfourci

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Posted 29 May 2020 - 02:07 PM

The bull has been on wheat pasture all winter should be fat as a pig. He is an easy keeper on top of that. When I say poor he has lost weight but won't ever have long hair he is just in poor condition as compared to the last time I looked at him. When he shakes his head the lump moves around but it moves in one piece which makes me think it is a foreign object. I did feed some native grass hay over the winter and it is common for it to have small mesquite limbs in the hay. It is just the nature of the beast around here on native grass hay. Not panting at all but his tongue is sticking out farther than it should due to the swelling and he is slobbering quite a bit. I did take my neighbor's advice and hit him with ivermectin 10 days ago but I have not seen a noticeable change in him. I agree on having to restrain him that being a problem in itself. The bull is only 5 and I would like to keep him for several more years but when he was two I could feed him cubes out of my hand he ended up with some net wrap around his horns and it was starting to cut into his flesh so we roped him and cut the net wrap off and he really does not like people since then. The last thing I would want is to make him worse about people than his is now

Thank you for your rapid response.



#4 BWfarms

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Posted 29 May 2020 - 03:51 PM

I'd rather have a healthy animal hate me than a sick one like me. A culture will get you the exact diagnosis. Don't hesitate any longer, catch him.
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#5 MScowman

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Posted 29 May 2020 - 06:14 PM

Could be Woody tongue, had a cow with it 2 years ago and it took 3 rounds of I.V. Iodine 3 days in a row to cure. It did and she is still a producer in my herd.


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#6 SCtrailrider

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Posted 29 May 2020 - 07:23 PM

I'd do whatever it took to be able to get my hands on it and see what may be wrong, if you want to keep him around on top of the ground and not under it tranquilize him and get to it while ya can... 


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#7 seventyfourci

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Posted 29 May 2020 - 10:36 PM

I think the hot setup is to tranquilize him. That way nobody gets hurt including him. Will I have to get a vet out here or can I buy the tranquilizer over the counter here in Texas? A culture I just assumed " and yes I know" I would lance it being as the ivermectin did not do anything.

 

I vaguely remember" woody tongue" but nothing specific about it please refresh my memory.

 

The list must be fairly short for possible causes, anything else it could be off the top of everyone's head. Has anyone used a pneumatic gun to tranquilize a bovine if so what did you use inside the dart?

 

I guess I would be money ahead just to get the local vet out here and let him take care of this problem. The last time he came out here was to look at one of the little women's horses. He told me then to tip those horns or he would not take the next call from one of us. So the local vet may not be an option



#8 SCtrailrider

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Posted 30 May 2020 - 06:18 AM

What is woody tongue?

Wooden tongue, or woody tongue, is an infection caused by the bacterium, Actinobacillus lignieresii, which lives only in the presence of oxygen. The bacteria invade tissue through breaks in the lining of the mouth. Any rough feed can cause mouth abrasions which allow entry of infection. Rough grasses, twigs, or stalks may initiate the disease. Wooden tongue occurs almost entirely in soft tissue with the tongue and lymph nodes of the head most often affected. The disease starts suddenly with the tongue becoming hard, swollen, and painful. Affected animals drool saliva and may appear to be chewing gently. The tongue often protrudes between the lips, and nodules and ulcers may be observed on the tongue. The animals are unable to eat or drink and rapidly lose condition. The disease is progressive and often fatal unless treated. It is important to begin treatment immediately as early treatment is usually successful, but advanced cases may fail to respond. Advanced cases may require surgical drainage and irrigation. Treated animals should be observed regularly, as relapses can occur. Transmission to other cattle may occur if discharges from wounds contaminate pasture. Isolate animals with discharging lesions in order to prevent the contamination of feed with the discharges.



#9 SCtrailrider

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Posted 30 May 2020 - 06:20 AM

https://www.farmheal.../wooden-tongue/



#10 Palmettokat

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Posted 30 May 2020 - 08:23 AM

It has been over forty years since we had any cows but I vote get a vet and the bull together asap. If you need to trailer him to a different vet believe the quicker the better.  

 

Like what BW said about rather having a healthy one hate him than a sick one love you. You can work on becoming friends later. 


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#11 Tim/South

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Posted 30 May 2020 - 10:31 PM

Do you have a picture? 
I am not familiar with woody tongue. I have had to lance a couple of swollen faces where the animal rubbed an itch and imbedded a splinter.
It agree with others that this sounds like a Vet visit. Might consider removing the horns (unless needed) while he is down. Especially since you intend to keep him a few more years.


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