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Is Bale Density that hard on a NH BC5070

6K views 24 replies 9 participants last post by  Modirt 
#1 ·
Last year we got a BC5070. In light dry hay I have a problem with the adjustments on the bales. I have used a JD348 for years with little or no problems. The NH has 3 on the top and 3 on the bottom of the feeding fingers rod. Is it that hard. We use another 5070 with bale skiis. I have used it and things worked ok. That can't be the problem? I get tired of rebaling busted bales because one string pops off. I have been baling since 1976 and never had this kind of a problem.
 
#3 · (Edited by Moderator)
Does your NH baler not have side resister doors or bale case wedges similar whats offered on JD 348?
On my 5070 it has both wedges and side doors (along with hydraulic bale tension). The key might be in the fist sentence 'light hay'. The 5070 is a hay eating machine (I believe the 348 can be too). I can remember that same problem in light hay with a JD 24t, which wasn't the hay eating machine of today's world. I would suggest bigger windrow and/or slowing down the PTO, while increasing ground speed.

Larry

PS I do love my bale skiis, too. Just helps the baler make idiot bricks for certain.
 
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#4 ·
I'm not sure I'm getting his question correct? Is it making puff balls or breaking the string? My 575 is basically the same machine and in heavy high moisture hay i will pop a string on bale exit or as soon as it hits the wagon or ground but rare do I get a loose bale? And it is a hay eating machine! I always feed it heavy because that makes the most consistent bales. It hates light windrows and if thats all I have, I have to shift up the ground speed.
 
#5 ·
I'm not sure I'm getting his question correct?
I was guessing his problem being on the cut side of the bale. Perhaps, he could adjust the feeding forks to over come that problem, but then in heavier hay he could have the opposite side doing the same thing, if he didn't re-adjust the forks. As you mentioned faster ground speed and/or larger windrows might be a easier/better solution.

Larry
 
#6 · (Edited by Moderator)
Does your NH baler not have side resister doors or bale case wedges similar whats offered on JD 348?
Yes it does ... the other NH is identical 'cept bale skiis.

I'm not sure I'm getting his question correct? Is it making puff balls or breaking the string? My 575 is basically the same machine and in heavy high moisture hay i will pop a string on bale exit or as soon as it hits the wagon or ground but rare do I get a loose bale? And it is a hay eating machine! I always feed it heavy because that makes the most consistent bales. It hates light windrows and if thats all I have, I have to shift up the ground speed.
Twine comes off when you pick them up.

I was guessing his problem being on the cut side of the bale. Perhaps, he could adjust the feeding forks to over come that problem, but then in heavier hay he could have the opposite side doing the same thing, if he didn't re-adjust the forks. As you mentioned faster ground speed and/or larger windrows might be a easier/better solution.

Larry
Yep tried that. Are the adjustments that critical? The other balers forks stay the same and we don't adjust. Not operator error either. It has Bale Skiis.
 
#7 ·
Twine comes off when you pick them up.
Just one side? If so, which side? (My guess, would be one side only, rational: smaller amount of material, finally getting grabbed by feeding forks, resulting in a partial feeding of plunger on one side. Causing a possible 'banana' bale.)

Does it comes off both sides (either side randomly)?

IDK if this could be a factor or not, what type of hay are you baling? What I'm thinking here is if it is grass, some seem to be slipperier when over dry (at lease in MY area). And if plastic twine (slipperier also, than sisal IMHO), you could have perfect storm.

Larry
 
#9 · (Edited by Moderator)
Just one side? If so, which side? (My guess, would be one side only, rational: smaller amount of material, finally getting grabbed by feeding forks, resulting in a partial feeding of plunger on one side. Causing a possible 'banana' bale.)

Does it comes off both sides (either side randomly)?

IDK if this could be a factor or not, what type of hay are you baling? What I'm thinking here is if it is grass, some seem to be slipperier when over dry (at lease in MY area). And if plastic twine (slipperier also, than sisal IMHO), you could have perfect storm.

Larry
Coastal on the cut side. If you get in heavier hay the uncut side. 10 bale pods not consistent on some. Maybe next year it will be better. With no measurable of rain and cooler temps ... looks like we are done this year. That last field doesn't look like it will make it.
 
#10 · (Edited by Moderator)
Just baled some Coastal drought stricken hay yesterday with a JD 348. 25 acres made a whopping 436 ss bales. I raked 3 nine ft swathes together for windrow. Bales were good & tight resembling bricks. Baler didn't mis-tie not 1 bale
 

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#11 ·
Just baled some Coastal drought stricken hay yesterday with a JD 348. 25 acres made a whopping 436 ss bales. I raked 3 nine ft swathes together for windrow. Bales were good & tight resembling bricks. Baler didn't mis-tie not 1 bale
They look great. i have a JD700 rake and in the past I have looped the field 4 times to throw 4 rows together. I have a 946/13ft cut. We have about 30 acres left and going to try that.
 
#12 ·
Coastal on the cut side. If you get in heavier hay the uncut side. 10 bale pods not consistent on some. Maybe next year it will be better. With no measurable of rain and cooler temps ... looks like we are done this year. That last field doesn't look like it will make it.
Did you happen to verify the timing is all set correctly?

I picked up a 348 this year and it kinda seems the higher capacity machine is much more finicky with side to side bale length than the older 336 I've been baling with, as the windrow gets heavier and lighter. The only thing I haven't liked about the machine.
 
#13 ·
Did you happen to verify the timing is all set correctly?

I picked up a 348 this year and it kinda seems the higher capacity machine is much more finicky with side to side bale length than the older 336 I've been baling with, as the windrow gets heavier and lighter. The only thing I haven't liked about the machine.
We took the book and went thru all the timings and tolerances.
 
#14 ·
Did you happen to verify the timing is all set correctly?

I picked up a 348 this year and it kinda seems the higher capacity machine is much more finicky with side to side bale length than the older 336 I've been baling with, as the windrow gets heavier and lighter. The only thing I haven't liked about the machine.
Actually there's not much difference between the 336 & 348 except 348 has wider pickup attachment,twice as many hay dogs & IIRC operates 20 strokes per minute faster at pto speed. Did you change setting on feeder forks during baling? How many bales per acre was hay producing?
 
#17 ·
Bales per acre was varying widely across the behavior in second cut grass and third and fourth cut alfalfa.

Yes, all 6 hay dogs are working as expected and springs are in good condition.

Yes, I always feed the baler from the far right.

Yes the auger drive belt is snug and the idler pulley is under the belt.
 
#20 ·
I thought this was about a NH 5070? Make sure you feed that monster and that all the dogs are working and springs are not broken,and it has at least the first row of wedges installed! Then you could tighten up doors and hydro-formatic pressure! I don't have any bale ski things on mine and it will pack a bale so tight the strings will "pop" if you drop the bale off the wagon! You can't even get your fingers under the strings!
 
#21 ·
I thought this was about a NH 5070? Make sure you feed that monster and that all the dogs are working and springs are not broken,and it has at least the first row of wedges installed! Then you could tighten up doors and hydro-formatic pressure! I don't have any bale ski things on mine and it will pack a bale so tight the strings will "pop" if you drop the bale off the wagon! You can't even get your fingers under the strings!
Yes it did start out that way on a 5070. I think the problem (on the 5070) was the windrows were not big enough. Maybe would have worked for my old 348. Should have changed the settings of the feeder forks when I went from light to little heavier. Made adjustment so the cut side would not be the problem (lighter hay) it did ok but next area was a little better and had problem with the uncut side. Its a learning curve because going from a JD348 wire to a NH5070 twine. Think I need a MF1840 ... it seems to be idiot proof. :D :D
 
#23 ·
Is the auger floating correctly? Our 336 and 348 behave almost the same except the 348 can go tighter and has extra packer fork settings that help in light hay.

If the auger is too high can cause clumps/wads.
Sorry I missed this earlier @slowzuki. Yes the auger is floating freely. I did lower the compressers about 2" towards the end of my season. I didn't have a lot to bale after that, but that may have helped a bit.
 
#25 ·
Again, late to this party.

Long story short, it seems to me that if a baler takes in an adequate charge of hay to uniformly fill the bale chamber with each plunger stroke, you are going to get a consistently square bale. That assumes the charge of hay is left in the middle of the chamber to spread evenly when it is compressed .....side to side and top to bottom.

In a former life, I ran a JD 336......can't ever remember any bad shaped bales. I've recently ran an older Massey baler and we had trouble with it. I currently have a NH 315.........and most of the time, it spits out bricks. That is when I've got decent hay and the windrows are consistent. That is not always the case........and do get the occasional funky bale. One side a bit longer.....or more unusual.......a concave bale.......bottom longer than the top. What gives?

A few years back, I attempted to bale hay with Massey Ferguson #9......a small entry level baler. In dry hay, we could never get it to do better than 40# cotton balls......then realized it didn't have any wedges. Actually, what Massey called a "retarder" plate, which is along the line of what JD uses and is different than the wedges NH uses. The "retarder" is a plate with grid of half moon pockets projecting into bale chamber. I can't imagine how bale skiis would improve on those.

Anyway, once you really start to evaluate balers, there are some subtle but significant differences in only a few places. For example, JD uses an auger to move hay from the pickup to the mouth of the bale chamber. That is a continuous flow.......and what hay you have stacks up right there, waiting for the packer fingers to pull it in. Stacks up pretty evenly. The JD's also have the retarder plate vs. the wedges (at least the older ones do).

Almost all other balers, including the New Hollands, use tines to move the hay sideways in a start stop motion. As long as the charge of hay with each plunger stroke is big enough to fill the chamber, and the packer fingers are timed right to leave it in the middle of the chamber........and not off to the far side......or just barely inside.......you get a decent shaped bale. I think this is the reason most guys will say a NH baler does best when you feed it heavy. It is getting a full charge of hay with each plunger stroke. So I think the NH and similar balers are more sensitive to the charge per stroke.....and that is tied to the feeding mechanism.....an auger vs. the tines.

After that, timing of the delivery factors in.......and on my NH 315, I can even adjust a baffle at the back of the pickup chamber to account for windrow size. Who does that? In theory, however, as per the book, that is an adjustment to make that will affect bale shape. Most of us do that on the fly by adjusting ground speed.

But back to the OP's issue with the 5070........I doubt the size of the material is as important as the amount of material you are running in with each stroke. My rule of thumb is to vary windrow size and speed until I can get flakes that average about 2 to 2.5 " in length. That means I'm getting a nice charge of hay with each stroke. Goal is about 15 flakes +/- per bale. Larger than that and I'm pushing it too hard........less and no telling what will happen.

Last baling, I double raked one field to get a nice windrow. Another field was light and I put 8 windrows together to make the same size. It wasn't worth baling.....but did it to clean up the field. Both made the same size and shape bales, although the latter were a bit funky on the corners as the material was very short.

My goal is to make 50# bricks. It took a bit of trial and error to figure out how to do that, but I do it by using 2 wedges, cranking down the tension and shortening the bale to about 30 to 32 inches. Drop one of those on a flatbed and it sounds like you dropped a cement block.
 
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